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+--- Thread: [TG] [TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs (/showthread.php?tid=6726)
[TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs - Boblloyd - 10-07-18 01:50 PM
Hi,
I bought a boat with RL80C Plus system with two MFDs, GPS, Pathfinder Radar, sonar, and ST6001 autopilot. On the Lower MFD the chart plotter GPS and radar work fine but the sonar isn't an available display. On the Upper MFD the sonar works fine and the radar is offered as a display but always shows a "Scanner Not Responding" message. The Chart plotter isn't even offered as a display on the upper MFD. The autopilot works fine at both locations. The lower MFD has two slots for C-MAP with one installed.
I understand this system depends on Seatalk as well as HSB2. Any thoughts on where to start with this problem?
Thanks, Bob
RE: [TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs - Tom - Raymarine - Moderator - 10-07-18 08:16 PM
Hello Bob,
Standard navigational info (depth, speed, wind, GPS etc.) goes through low-speed Seatalk. Graphical type connections (radar, chart, sonar) go through the higher-speed HSB2. The fact that the pilot works from both displays shows that your Seatalk network is ok, your problem is with your HSB2 network.
The HSB2 cabling was very prone to poor contacts on the push-in, hard-rubbery connectors, which is why we've gone away from that connector type in all more-recent designs. The simplest explanation is that the cables aren't making a good contact any more. They're simply crimp spade terminals over-moulded with rubber and were prone to splaying out over time and fitting/removal. Try running another bit of 3-core cable with 3.2mm (1/8") crimp terminals and see if that makes a difference.
If one or both of your displays are HSB2/Pathfinder Plus hardware (not a given: it was possible to upgrade non-Plus hardware to partial HSB2-compatibility through software, and we offered replacement decals that said Plus...) then you'll external network terminators piggybacked in the back of the displays. The connectors on these are also suspect, as above. Each terminator had a resistance of 120 ohms between the active pair (the two pins side-by-side) so if you suspect one, try adding a resistor of that value across the back of your crimp terminals.
If neither of these makes a difference then you've probably got a failed ARCnet transceiver chip in one or other display. These were prone to static damage. On Plus hardware (the surest way to tell was the logo on the splashscreen at startup, Raymarine generally meant HSB2, Raytheon always meant HSB1) you could get some idea whether this was the case or not by the resistance on the active pair of pins in the back of the display, with the terminator removed. My memory was that approx. 2kOhms was healthy something like 20kOhms meant a failed chip. If you measure ~120 ohms you're measuring a terminator: either inside (HSB1 hardware) or still plugged in externally. Measure with power removed.
If the ARCnet chip has failed then that's probably final, I'm sorry to say - we don't have the component or PCBs any longer for repairs, the displays are too old for that.
Regards,
Tom
RE: [TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs - Boblloyd - 10-09-18 05:18 AM
Thanks for the detailed reply Tom. I only see Raymarine splash screens. I'll check the HSB2 connections as you suggest. What's puzzling to me is how the Upper MFD receives graphical Sonar data and the Lower MFD receives graphical radar data. Does that prove the HSB2 interface in both are at least partially functional? -Bob
RE: [TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs - Tom - Raymarine - Moderator - 10-12-18 01:32 AM
I'd suspect that radar is physically connected to the lower display and sounder to the lower. RL80C is a radar (+optional chart) rather than sounder display so if you're seeing sounder capability on the lower display and it definitely is RL80C (not L12x0C, for example) then that implies that you have a DSM250 sounder module connected to that display over HSB2 and that part of the network is working. If it's an L12x0 on the other hand then this can take a transducer connection directly, so nothing is proven about the HSB2 network.
Do you have a DSM somewhere in the network, connected via a Y-cable? the Y could be at the DSM or at the lower display.
Does either of the products that does not have a Y, have a terminator?
Tom
RE: [TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs - Boblloyd - 10-13-18 07:08 PM
Right you are Tom. The radar connects directly to the Lower MFD. I checked the upper MFD and the HSB had a terminator plug measuring 118 ohms. Looking into vacant MFD connector I measured 2.2 K ohms. Reasonable so far. However, when I measured looking into the cable end I measured 16 meg ohms, expecting to see 120 ohms. Pulling the panel on the lower MFD could see a DSM with a Y connector. The connector on one leg was coming loose. Awful access but I was able to reseat the connector but then I noticed the Y had a terminator going into the DSM. I don't think that's right so I removed it. Is that correct? Anyway everything works now on both MFDs. Pretty good for a 15 year old system. I'll upgrade soon but happy for the time being.
Many thanks, Bob
(10-12-18 01:32 AM)Tom - Raymarine - Moderator Wrote: I'd suspect that radar is physically connected to the lower display and sounder to the lower. RL80C is a radar (+optional chart) rather than sounder display so if you're seeing sounder capability on the lower display and it definitely is RL80C (not L12x0C, for example) then that implies that you have a DSM250 sounder module connected to that display over HSB2 and that part of the network is working. If it's an L12x0 on the other hand then this can take a transducer connection directly, so nothing is proven about the HSB2 network.
Do you have a DSM somewhere in the network, connected via a Y-cable? the Y could be at the DSM or at the lower display.
Does either of the products that does not have a Y, have a terminator?
Tom
RE: [TG11] RL80C Plus system - all functions work but not at both MFDs - Tom - Raymarine - Moderator - 10-15-18 01:36 AM
Yes, they sound like classic HSB2 problems. I'm glad it's working now.
Tom