[CA] [CA11] 2002 Era Electronics Integration To Sea Talk ng Radar & e125 MFD

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Upgrade Help Request:

Thanks in advance to everyone who’s contributed to the forum. Your advice is invaluable.

Ok, thanks to Chuck and others, I think I now know enough to be dangerous when it comes to electronics upgrades & Sea Ray Networking.

Bought a 2002 Sea Ray with original era Raymarine electronics, listed below. Additionally, there is a “Sea Ray Navigator” computer utilizing NMEA 0183 to talk to the autopilot w/ST7001+ control head and hopefully the rest of the sea ray components. The SR Navigator has a built in Garmin GPS system with antenna connecting directly to it as well. I assume the Sea Ray components all use SeaTalk 1.

I want to balance getting some updated electronics for use inland on the great lakes, without investing too much in a 2002 boat. Given that, I’ve decided to update the radar and keep all other relevant working components I can. I’m planning to replace my analog radar and RL80C with a reman Raymarine Super HD 48” open array and a reman e125 MFD. I’m hoping to remove the now redundant A70 while keeping the pilot, depth, VHF and Cummins engine monitors. I believe I’ll need a GPS antenna for the e125 giving me a few devices using Sea Talk ng, several using Sea Talk 1 and the SR Nav using NMEA 0183. I’d like to use the e125 as radar and primary plotter for my pilot and have the SR Nav for redundancy or backup. All this said, do I need to convert the old devices signals to Sea Talk ng? Is there one backbone or bus I can convert to which might facilitate all communication? Any help on the best way to network would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

Current Configuration:
Raymarine analog 48" open array radar - Replacing
Raymarine RL80C Pathfinder Plus Display/Controller - Replacing
Raymarine A70 – Remove and not replace
Raymarine ST7001+ Autopilot – Like to keep
Raymarine ST60 Depth finder – Like to keep
Sea Ray Navigator computer by Maptech – Like to keep
Dual Cummins engine status display's which work very well – Like to keep
Raymarine Ray240 VHF – Like to keep

Walter

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Welcome to the Raymarine Forum Walter,

The key to determining how to interface the autopilot to the new MFD is first determine which model of autopilot course computer has been installed onboard the boat. This boat was manufactured around the time that Raymarine had begun introducing new autopilot course computers and the OEM (Sea Ray may have installed an older model which was in their inventory). Please note that the ST7000 is an autopilot control head, which in turn has been interfaced to an autopilot course computer. Please locate and identify the model of autopilot course computer which has been installed onboard the boat or alternatively, attach a photo of the autopilot's course computer. Please additionally note that Raymarine's online refurbished products store is indicating no inventory of any model of e-Series MFD.

[[email protected]]

Thank you for the support Chuck and Team.

I have a Raymarine 150G course computer.

Under the dash, the ST 60 depth finder is connected to the ST7001+ pilot control head via a SeaTalk cable, the Radar display is connected to a 4 port SeaTalk black box with a second port cable going "somewhere" (another device or spliced into the 150G, I forgot now). The A70 and Sirius Weather SR50 are already utilizing ST ng connections. Not sure how effective that bus is or whether they are communicating with any other components. They provide GPS to the VHF.

I did purchase a SeaTalk to SeaTalk ng converter p/n E22158 just in case this is all that's needed. After thinking about it, I'm OK with getting rid of the Sea Ray Navigator (if I have to) and of course the A70. In theory, adding the e125 should allow me to connect to the pilot, depth and vhf if I'm not mistaken. Just not sure how all this will talk. Should I plan SeaTalk to ng conversion, NMEA 0183 from the e125 to the course computer, combination or something else. Thank you in advance.

Walter

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Walter,

Q1. Under the dash, the ST 60 depth finder is connected to the ST7001+ pilot control head via a SeaTalk cable.
A1. It would be recommended that that the ST60 Depth instrument be disconnected from the ST7001+ autopilot control head. It would be recommended that the ST60 Depth instrument be connected to the SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter Cable supplied with the SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter Kit. An appropriate length of SeaTalk cable would then be used to connect the ST60 Depth instrument's second SeaTalk port to the remaining SeaTalk port of the 150G autopilot course computer. When connecting the ST60 depth instrument to the autopilot course computer, only the data (yellow) and ground (shield) leads of the SeaTalk cable should be used. The cable's red lead should be insulated to prevent shorting. Please click here to view a FAQ addressing how the MFD would be interfaced to the backbone (SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter) and how the backbone would be powered.

Q2. the Radar display is connected to a 4 port SeaTalk black box with a second port cable going "somewhere" (another device or spliced into the 150G, I forgot now).
A2. Please respond with a photo of the "black box" as I am unable to identify it.

Q3. The A70 and Sirius Weather SR50 are already utilizing ST ng connections. Not sure how effective that bus is or whether they are communicating with any other components. They provide GPS to the VHF.
A3. No external GPS sensor has been identified within this system. Should a MFD having an internal GPS receiver be installed in a location which fails to afford it an unobstructed view of the skies overhead, then the MFD's internal GPS may have difficulty acquiring a FIX, maintaining a FIX, and/or suffer reduced accuracy of the FIX. The SR150 is not compatible with MFD designs introduced since the A-Series Classic MFDs. Some of the backbone components which had been used to interface them may be potentially used to interface additional devices (ex. Raystar 150 GPS Sensor, etc.) to the system.

Q4. In theory, adding the e125 should allow me to connect to the pilot, depth and vhf if I'm not mistaken.
A4. Correct.

Regarding the Ray240, it is recommended that it be interfaced to the NMEA 0183 output port 2 of the 150G to receive GPS data from the system.

[[email protected]]

**Update**

Chuck, Team Raymarine,

After pulling several dash panels and getting unobstructed view, I have a complete and accurate configuration update. This might be completely irrelevant given new config plans. After reading Interfacing products having a SeaTalk interface to SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000, I am definitely more informed and dangerous.

** Radar/RL80C - This unit will be decommissioned
(Config has changed slightly from my original post and is NOT connected to the 5 port Sea Talk junction box, previously reported as a 4 port SeaTalk block)

>Power NMEA port Plug/Cable - Direct wired to power block and yellow & orange (only) go to + - NNEA 1 out block on the 150G

>Transducer Port Plug/Cable - White to Radar Array

>SeaTalk Port Plug/Cable - To one SeaTalk port on ST7001+ Pilot Control

** A70 MFD - This unit will be decommissioned

>Power Plug Cable - Power Only

>SeaTalk ng Port Plug/Cable - SeaTalk ng out and to converter SeaTalk (1) end, plugged into port 1 on SeaTalk 5 port junction box

** SeaTalk 5 Port junction box (See picture)

>Port 1 - From A70 converted SeaTalk ng to SeaTalk

>Ports 2 through 4 - Empty

>Port 5 - This has the SeaTalk arm of a Y cable connected. Port 5 has one arm of the Y and is SeaTalk. 2nd arm is SeaTalk ng and goes to the SR50 SeaTalk ng port. The base of the Y goes to Power.

** ST7001+ Pilot Control

>SeaTalk Port 1 - To From RL80C Radar Display

>SeaTalk Port 2 - Spliced out to SeaTalk block on 150G

** ST 60 Depth
((change from my original observation) Config tells me this is only showing depth and not reporting to any other component. This shouldn't change your A1. from the last post and I will follow unless I hear different.)

>SeaTalk Port 1 - Power Only

>SeaTalk Port 2 - Open

>3 Pin - Transducer

** Sea Ray Navigator

>NMEA 0183 - Spliced to NMEA 2 in block on 150G
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The new configuration, again, will have the following components:

SeaTalk to SeaTalk ng converter is available
SeaTalk 5 port junction box is available

150G Course Computer
e125 MFD (w/Super HD Radar connected to Raynet port) - Where do I connect?
A70 Control Head - Connected to first SeaTalk on 150G should it stay there?
ST60 Depth - Not networked, but plan to daisy chain to A70 via SeaTalk Cable.
SR50 Weather - Where do I connect?
Ray240 VHF - Connected to 150G NMEA 2 out and plan to keep it that way
Sea Ray Navigator - Connected to 150G NMEA 2 in and plan to keep it that way

With the decommissioned items gone, I will have NMEA 1 in & out and the second SeaTalk available on the 150G. NMEA 2 in still has the Sea Ray Nav and out has the Ray240 unless that should change. Given the Sea Talk daisy chain and SeaTalk to SeaTalk ng capabilities with the converter I bought, my biggest questions are around connecting the remaining SeaTalk ng (e125, SR50) and SeaTalk (A70, ST60) components. Was thinking e125 NMEA to 150G NMEA 1 in & out and SR50 to converter who's yellow receptacle will take the plug from the last SeaTalk port on the ST60. This should close the loop unless I'm missing something. Not sure if power is needed to that converter also...

Hope my chaos is discernible. Thank you in advance for any help. I think I'm close here.

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Walter,

Q1. Did you see my earlier note concerning the availability of remanufactured e-Series MFDs? Have you been able to successfully purchase a remanufactured e125?

General comments
Q2. ** Radar/RL80C - Power NMEA port Plug/Cable - yellow & orange (only) go to + - NNEA 1 out block on the 150G.
A2. This is how the RL80C was supplied with 10Hz heading data from the course computer. One set of the e125 MFD's NMEA 0183 input leads will be interfaced to the same terminals of the autopilot course computer to supply the e125 MFD with 10Hz heading data.

Q3>SeaTalk Port Plug/Cable - To one SeaTalk port on ST7001+ Pilot Control
A3> This cable will no longer be used and the ST7001+ will alone be connected to one of the SeaTalk ports of the autopilot course computer. This SeaTalk Cable will be connected to all three terminals of the autopilot course computer's SeaTalk port.

Q4. A70 MFD - SeaTalk ng Port Plug/Cable - SeaTalk ng out and to converter SeaTalk (1) end, plugged into port 1 on SeaTalk 5 port junction box
** SeaTalk 5 Port junction box (See picture)
>Port 1 ...
A4. From A70 converted SeaTalk ng to SeaTalk --- this is an incorrect statement. The A70 adapted to SeaTalk2, or more correctly stated, is connected to to a CANBUS which has been constructed from SeaTalk2 networking components to support communications between the A70 MFD and the SR50.

Q5. ** ST7001+ Pilot Control
>SeaTalk Port 1 - To From RL80C Radar Display
>SeaTalk Port 2 - Spliced out to SeaTalk block on 150G
A5. Only one port of the ST7000+ will be used and it will be interfaced to the autopilot course computer in the manner specified within my response to Q3

Q6. ** ST 60 Depth
((change from my original observation) Config tells me this is only showing depth and not reporting to any other component. This shouldn't change your A1. from the last post and I will follow unless I hear different.)
A6. Correct. The second SeaTalk port of the ST60 will be connected to the remaining SeaTalk port of the autopilot course computer. This SeaTalk Cable will be connected to only the data (yellow) and ground (silver) terminals of the autopilot course computer's SeaTalk port.

Q7. ** Sea Ray Navigator
>NMEA 0183 - Spliced to NMEA 2 in block on 150G
A7. No need to change
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The new configuration, again, will have the following components:

Q8. SeaTalk to SeaTalk ng converter is available
A8. The SeaTalkng to SeaTalk2 Adapter cable linking the A70 to the SeaTalk2 Junction block is not the same thing as a SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter.

Q9. SeaTalk 5 port junction box is available
A10. This is a SeaTalk2 Junction Block

Q10. 150G Course Computer
e125 MFD (w/Super HD Radar connected to Raynet port) - Where do I connect?
A10. Please click here to view a FAQ addressing this subject. The MFD will be interfaced to a spur socket within the backbone created by the SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter Kit. Please additionally see my responses to Q2 and Q6

Q11. A70 Control Head - Connected to first SeaTalk on 150G should it stay there?
A11. I assume that you meant ST7000+ control head. See my response to Q5

Q12. ST60 Depth - Not networked, but plan to daisy chain to A70 via SeaTalk Cable.
A12. Once again, I assume that you meant ST7000+ control head. The ST60 instrument should not be daisy chained to the ST7000+ control head. See my responses to Q6 and Q10.

Q11. SR50 Weather - Where do I connect?
A11. The SR50 is not supported for use with MFDs running LightHouse II software. Should SiriusXM satellite weather/radio features be desired, then it would be necessary to locate and interface a legacy SR100, SR6, or SR150 to the system. As these items are no longer produced by Rayamrine, it would be necessary to source one of these SiriusXM receivers from the second hand market. The currently marketed SR200 is not compatible with a/c/e/eS/gS-Series MFDs.

Q12. Ray240 VHF - Connected to 150G NMEA 2 out and plan to keep it that way.
A12. Noted.

Q13. Sea Ray Navigator - Connected to 150G NMEA 2 in and plan to keep it that way
A13. Noted.

Q14. Was thinking e125 NMEA to 150G NMEA 1 in & out
A14. Negative ... e125 in to 150G NMEA 1 out. Navigational data will be communicated between the MFD and 150G via the SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter.

Q15. SR50 to converter who's yellow receptacle will take the plug from the last SeaTalk port on the ST60.
A16. Negative. See the response to Q11.

[[email protected]]

Thank you.

I will complete over the winter and reply with progress so others may take or contribute.

This forum is an amazing resource with, clearly, talented and passionate people. Raymarine products are truly the de facto standard for me. I hope to learn enough about the legacy products to assist others as I've been assisted. Also looking forward to buying all new Raymarine technology with our new boat in the future.

Walter

[[email protected]]

Good progress on this upgrade/conversion, however, I have some quick questions.

Final Config =

e125 MFD
150G Course Computer
ST7001+ Control
ST60
Ray240 VHF
Sea Ray Navigator

I'm retracting Q1 as I caught the error of my ways. If I did this, there would be no SeaTalk network connection between the e125 and the 150G, only the e125 and ST60. I did want to leave it in for the forum though.

Q1. RETRACTED - Does my SeaTalk to SeaTalkng converted bus need to be powered? The only components on the converter will be the e125 which will be powered by the R62379 power/data//Video cable, and the ST60 which currently receives power from a switched circuit on my dash sw pannel. I'd like to keep it that way if possible. The 150G course computer currently receives depth from the Sea Ray Navigator, so, I don't need to connect the ST60 to the SeaTalk port on said unit. I'm thinking of leaving the power and simply connecting the ST60 to the SeaTalk converter to give the e125 depth awareness.

Q2. Can I run the red SeaTalk SeaTalkng converter power cable through the dash switch? That converter will not need to be under constant power, correct? It will power the bus when switched on allowing me to keep the switch in line, power and connect the ST60 if i'm right.

Q3. The e125 will be powered by the R62379 power/data/video cable. How does connecting to the, now powered, SeaTalkng converter handle that? Does it get power from the bus, sense it's being powered by the larger power/data/video cable or something else i'm missing?

Q3. Will the e125 on the SeaTalk network and Sea Ray Navigator on the NMEA in port on the 150G conflict? Of course, I want the e125 to be the master. Currently, the Navigator provides Plotting, GPS, depth (through its own transducer) and a route to the pilot if I activate one. All this via that NMEA 2 in. I don't plan to activate routes and am keeping it for backup, underwater topography and a few others things. Not knowing message order priority, I was concerned because there is almost always a discrepancy in depth and GPS from one device to the other.

I will post the final schematic of proposed install/setup once I have it completed. Thanks again,

Walter

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Walter,

Q2a. Can I run the red SeaTalk SeaTalkng converter power cable through the dash switch?
A2a. I'm not certain which switch you are referring to. I simply recommend that it be interfaced to a 12VDC power circuit which may be switched OFF when the system will not be used.

Q2b. That converter will not need to be under constant power, correct? It will power the bus when switched on allowing me to keep the switch in line, power and connect the ST60 if i'm right.
A2b. The SeaTalkng backbone need not be under constant power. It need only be powered when the system is in use. The SeaTalkng backbone will power the SeaTalk bus via the SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter ... this supplying power to any ST60 instruments, etc. which have been interfaced to and are designed to be powered from a SeaTalk bus.

Q3a. The e125 will be powered by the R62379 power/data/video cable. How does connecting to the, now powered, SeaTalkng converter handle that?
A3a. The two are unrelated to one another and each must be powered.

Q3b. Does it get power from the bus, sense it's being powered by the larger power/data/video cable or something else i'm missing?
A3b. The e125 is not powered by the SeaTalkng backbone.

Q3a. Will the e125 on the SeaTalk network and Sea Ray Navigator on the NMEA in port on the 150G conflict?
A3a. The system which you will be creating cannot automatically coordinate mastership of navigation ... as would a system of compatible MFD which had been interfaced to one another. Accordingly, the operator must ensure that only one navigation data source will be sending commands to the autopilot at any time. Accordingly, should navigation (Go To waypoint / cursor or follow route) be commanded by either system, then it will be necessary to command that system to stop navigation (ex. Stop Follow) on that system prior to commanding navigation from the other system.

Q2b. Of course, I want the e125 to be the master. Currently, the Navigator provides Plotting, GPS, depth (through its own transducer) and a route to the pilot if I activate one. All this via that NMEA 2 in. I don't plan to activate routes and am keeping it for backup, underwater topography and a few others things. Not knowing message order priority, I was concerned because there is almost always a discrepancy in depth and GPS from one device to the other.
A2b. Within such systems, I would typically recommend that physical switch(es) be installed between the NMEA 0183 output between the MFD and autopilot course computer as well as between the SeaTalk bus (coming from the SeaTalk to SeaTalkng Converter) and the SeaTalk port of the autopilot course computer to ensure that only one device will be transmitting navigation and GPS data to the autopilot course computer at any time. In the case of the latter the SeaTalk Cable's data (yellow) lead would be switched.

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Chuck, Team,

Verification question:

I wasn't sure if the ST 1 to ng bus required power to allow communication between devices or, that power was used to run the devices.

Q1: Does the SeaTalk 1 to ng Converter E22158 have to be powered by the red and black cable if all components, in my case one depth finer, have their own source of power?

Pictures of the new installation will be posted upon completion. Thank you in advance.

Walter