[CA] [CA11] New Raymarine system & questions . . .

[Martin35]

Chuck,

Last month I purchased a 2000 Beneteau 311 with hardly any electronics, just a 19 year old Raymarine Tridata and ST-60 wind, neither of which works. So, it’s time for new electronics.

I sold my last boat in 1998 and one thing I have learned that is that marine electronics today is a different world than it was in 1998. I have spent the last month trying to catch up.

For the new (to me) Beneteau, I’ve decided to go with a complete Raymarine system (except for the VHF, which has DSC and AIS receive capability) which hopefully will simplify connecting everything and ensuring compatibility of components.

I have purchased the following and am about ready to install, but before I head to the boat later this week I would really appreciate your comments on the attached installation and connection diagram as I’m sure I have missed something.

Here’s the equipment list, plus I have enough Raymarine backbone and spur cables to do the job:

- Raymarine Evolution EV-100 Wheel Autopilot Pack w P70s Control Head
- Raymarine i50/i60 Depth, Speed & Wind Systems Pack
- Raymarine i70s Instrument Display
- Raymarine ITC-5
- Rarmarine Axiom 7 Chartplotter w Navionics (no transducers)
- Simrad RS35 VHF w DSC and AIS Receiver
- Raymarine STng 5 way backbone connectors -2
- Raymarine STng T backbone T connectors - 2

Here are my questions:

1. The Axiom 7 has a NEMA 2000 male connection feeding out, so to interface it to the STng backbone I think I need the A06045 Micro-C Device Net cable, correct? If not correct, what cable or adapter do I need?

2. Same question for the Simrad RS35, it has a NEMA 2000 male connection, so I think I need the A06045 cable, correct? Again, if not correct, what do I need?

3. I want to power the STng backbone via a separate 12V-DC connection which will connect to the STng backbone via the ITC-5. The STng backbone will be on a separate breaker at the DC panel marked “Instruments”. Is this an acceptable location to connect 12V-DC power to the STng backbone? Would it better to connect power by a separate T connector with balanced LEN on either side? Finally, should I also install an in-line fuse in addition to the breaker panel? If so, what value?

4. Re LEN values, this is a small, short system, so I think I can probably ignore the advice to balance the LEN values on either side of the power connection to the backbone. Is this correct? Or is it good practice to balance the LEN values even in a small system? My longest backbone run will be 5 meters (about 16’ 4”), the other two runs will be 1 meter (about 3’ 3”) each, so total backbone length about 23’.

5. At the DC panel, I will have separate, fused, switchable on/off power connections for the ACU-100 (marked “Autopilot”), the Axion 7 (marked “Chartplotter”), and the Simrad RS35 (marked “VHF”) so I can turn each of them off when anchored to conserve battery life. I understand that the ACU-100 can also power the STng backbone but that the function for that can be turned off in setup, correct? Is there anything else I need to be careful about in terms of protecting the STng backbone from the devices that are separately powered?

6. Can the i50 Depth, the i50 Speed, and the i60 Wind be daisy-chained as I have shown on the diagram?

7. I understand that the i50 Depth, i50 Speed, i60 Wind, I70s MFD and P70s APCH are all powered by the STng backbone and that no separate power connections are required for these instruments, correct?

8. The Simrad RS35 manual says it is capable of displaying AIS and DSC data on NEMA 2000 compatible chartplotters. Is there any reason why the Axion 7 would not be compatible? Both will be NEMA 2000 connected to the backbone.

9. Will the Axion 7 properly display STng network Depth, Speed, and Wind data via it’s NEMA 2000 connection as long as the correct adapter is used? Does the data it displays come from the i70s or via the ITC-5 converter? Do I need to do anything to select the data source?


That’s it. And thanks in advance, not just for your comments on my post but on the work you do every day. Most of what I have learned in the last month about the current state of marine electronics has been from reading your posts and comments on the Raymarine forum. You are providing a really valuable resource to Raymarine users and it is very much appreciated.

Regards,

Martin

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Welcome to the Raymarine Forum Martin35,

Q1. The Axiom 7 has a NEMA 2000 male connection feeding out, so to interface it to the STng backbone I think I need the A06045 Micro-C Device Net cable, correct? If not correct, what cable or adapter do I need?
A1. Correct. Additional options may be found within first paragraph of the FAQ found here.

Q2. Same question for the Simrad RS35, it has a NEMA 2000 male connection, so I think I need the A06045 cable, correct? Again, if not correct, what do I need?
A2. I would recommend double checking with Simrad's support team to verify that the RS35 feature a DeviceNet (M) socket. If so, then my response to Q1 would apply to the RS35 as well.

Q3a. I want to power the STng backbone via a separate 12V-DC connection which will connect to the STng backbone via the ITC-5. The STng backbone will be on a separate breaker at the DC panel marked “Instruments”. Is this an acceptable location to connect 12V-DC power to the STng backbone?
A3a. The chosen spur socket will not support a balanced LEN Load. A spur socket should be located closer to the center of the backbone's LEN Load.

Q3b. Would it better to connect power by a separate T connector with balanced LEN on either side?
A3b. Yes.

Q3c. Finally, should I also install an in-line fuse in addition to the breaker panel? If so, what value?
A3c. The answer is dependent upon whether you can locate a breaker rated for 5A. If not, then an inline fuse should be installed.

Q4. Re LEN values, this is a small, short system, so I think I can probably ignore the advice to balance the LEN values on either side of the power connection to the backbone. Is this correct? Or is it good practice to balance the LEN values even in a small system? My longest backbone run will be 5 meters (about 16’ 4”), the other two runs will be 1 meter (about 3’ 3”) each, so total backbone length about 23’.
A4. While it is less important to balance the LEN load in small backbones, doing so would still be recommended. Should a problem arise with an unbalanced backbone, one of the first recommendations which would likely be suggested is to balance the backbone's LEN load and then to re-test the system.

Q5. At the DC panel, I will have separate, fused, switchable on/off power connections for the ACU-100 (marked “Autopilot”), the Axion 7 (marked “Chartplotter”), and the Simrad RS35 (marked “VHF”) so I can turn each of them off when anchored to conserve battery life. I understand that the ACU-100 can also power the STng backbone but that the function for that can be turned off in setup, correct?
A5. This is an incorrect statement. Only an ACU200 and ACU400 support supplying power to a SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000 backbone.

Q6. Can the i50 Depth, the i50 Speed, and the i60 Wind be daisy-chained as I have shown on the diagram?
A5. Yes. However, it would be considered to be a best installation practice to install them as individual spurs to the backbone. As this is a sailing vessel, should it feature an instruments pod, then please click here to view the FAQ providing recommendations for routing the backbone.

Q7. I understand that the i50 Depth, i50 Speed, i60 Wind, I70s MFD and P70s APCH are all powered by the STng backbone and that no separate power connections are required for these instruments, correct?
A7. Correct.

Q8. The Simrad RS35 manual says it is capable of displaying AIS and DSC data on NEMA 2000 compatible chartplotters. Is there any reason why the Axion 7 would not be compatible? Both will be NEMA 2000 connected to the backbone.
A8. Negative. As long as a third party AIS receiver/transceiver supports NMEA 2000 or NMEA 0183 communications (the latter must be bridged to NMEA 2000) and is transmitting properly constructed NMEA 2000 PGNs, then the Axiom MFD should support plotting AIS targets and displaying data associated with these NMEA 2000 PGNs.

Q9. Will the Axion 7 properly display STng network Depth, Speed, and Wind data via it’s NEMA 2000 connection as long as the correct adapter is used? Does the data it displays come from the i70s or via the ITC-5 converter? Do I need to do anything to select the data source?
A9. The iTC-5 will actually be the data source for depth, speed, and wind data. As this system features only one source of data for each type of data, the Data Sources feature need not be exercised.

[Martin35]

A1. Correct. Additional options may be found within first paragraph of the FAQ found here.
- OK, thanks.

A2. I would recommend double checking with Simrad's support team to verify that the RS35 feature a DeviceNet (M) socket. If so, then my response to Q1 would apply to the RS35 as well.
- OK, will double check with Simrad.

A3a. The chosen spur socket will not support a balanced LEN Load. A spur socket should be located closer to the center of the backbone's LEN Load.
- I will reconfigure for a balanced load and submit another diagram.

A3b. Yes.
- Will do.

A3c. The answer is dependent upon whether you can locate a breaker rated for 5A. If not, then an inline fuse should be installed.
- Will do.

A4. While it is less important to balance the LEN load in small backbones, doing so would still be recommended. Should a problem arise with an unbalanced backbone, one of the first recommendations which would likely be suggested is to balance the backbone's LEN load and then to re-test the system.
- OK, got it.

A5. This is an incorrect statement. Only an ACU200 and ACU400 support supplying power to a SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000 backbone.
- OK, got it. Separate 12V connection to the STng backbone and not via the ACU100.

A5. Yes. However, it would be considered to be a best installation practice to install them as individual spurs to the backbone. As this is a sailing vessel, should it feature an instruments pod, then please click here to view the FAQ providing recommendations for routing the backbone.
- OK, will run them off separate spurs.

A8. Negative. As long as a third party AIS receiver/transceiver supports NMEA 2000 or NMEA 0183 communications (the latter must be bridged to NMEA 2000) and is transmitting properly constructed NMEA 2000 PGNs, then the Axiom MFD should support plotting AIS targets and displaying data associated with these NMEA 2000 PGNs.
- OK, thanks.

A9. The iTC-5 will actually be the data source for depth, speed, and wind data. As this system features only one source of data for each type of data, the Data Sources feature need not be exercised.
- OK, thanks. Good reason to use the ITC-5.

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Noted and you're welcome.

[Martin35]

Chuck,

I'm having some trouble identifying accurate LEN values so I can balance the system.

You mentioned in one of your FAQ posts that the LEN values can be found in the specification portion of the device's owners manual but that is not the case. Perhaps it was at one time, but I've looked at all of the manuals for my devices and there is no listing for the LEN value. Sometimes the manual contains unlabled icons with LEN values in a diagram of a sample system, but I often can't identify the device the icon represents as many of the icons look alike.

Similarly, there is no information in the owners manual on the mA draw for the instrument which would let one calculate the LEN, using one LEN =50mA. What has been most helpful is the out-of-date spreadsheet you attached to the FAQ listing LEN values of some instruments but it omits many of the current selection of devices sold by Raymarine.

Using the spreadsheet and some guesswork, I have listed what I think is the LEN value for the following devices. I would appreciate it if you would take a look at the list and let me know where the stated LEN value is not accurate and, if so, the accurate LEN value. Here's the list:

ITC-5 3
i60 Wind Instrument 4
i50 Depth Instrument 4
i50 Speed Instrument 4
P319 Depth Transducer 1
P120 Speed Transducer 1
E22078 Short Arm Wind 1
i70s Multifunction Display 3
P70s Auto Pilot Control Head 3
ACU-100 Evolution Autopilot 3
Axion 7 MFD 1
EV-1 Sensor Core 1
EV-100 Wheel Autopilot 1
Simrad RS-35 VHF 1

Total LEN value: 31

Thanks in advance.

Regards,

Martin

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Martin35,

Q: I've looked at all of the manuals for my devices and there is no listing for the LEN value.
A: From the respective product installation guides:
ITC-5 3; Chapter 5.6 Technical specification - correct
i60 Wind Instrument 4; Chapter 13.1 Technical specification - correct
i50 Depth Instrument 4; Chapter 12.1 Technical specification - correct
i50 Speed Instrument 4; Chapter 12.1 Technical specification - correct
P319 Depth Transducer 1; N/A - analog sensor (i.e. not interfaced to SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000 backbone)
P120 Speed Transducer 1; N/A - analog sensor (i.e. not interfaced to SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000 backbone)
E22078 Short Arm Wind 1; N/A - analog sensor (i.e. not interfaced to SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000 backbone)
i70s Multifunction Display 3; Chapter 17.1 Technical specification - correct
P70s Auto Pilot Control Head 3; Chapter 15.1 Technical specification - correct
ACU-100 Evolution Autopilot 3; Chapter 9.2 Technical specification — ACU-100, ACU-150 - LEN = 1
Axion 7 MFD 1; Chapter 8.1 Axiom tech specs - correct
EV-1 Sensor Core 1; Chapter 9.1 Technical specification — EV-1 and EV-2 - correct
EV-100 Wheel Autopilot 1; N/A - drive unit (i.e. not interfaced to SeaTalkng / NMEA 2000 backbone)
Simrad RS-35 VHF 1

Assuming that the Simrad RS-35's LEN value is correct, the total LEN value: 25

[Martin35]

Chuck,

Thanks. I have just a couple of final questions.

1. For the P319 depth transducer, the P120 Speed Transducer, the E22078 Short Arm Wind, you indicate: "N/A - analog sensor (i.e. not interfaced to SeaTalkng/Nmea 2000 Backbone".

The analog transducers will be connected to the ITC-5 and will therefore, indirectly, be on the SeaTalkng backbone, with data fed from the ITC-5 via the Seatalkng backbone to the i70s which, in turn, repeats the data to the i60W, the i50 depth, and the i50 speed. I just want to confirm that this method of connection IITC-5) does not trigger a LEN value for the analog transducers that I need to consider.

2. And for the EV-100 Wheel Autopilot, you indicate: "N/A - drive unit (i.e. not interfaced to SeaTalkng/NMEA 2000 Backbone".

As for the EV-100 Wheel Autopilot, the motor that drives the wheel is obviously not connected to the SeaTalkng backbone, but the rest of the EV-100 components (EV-1 Sensor Core, ACU-100, p70s controller) will all be connected to the SeaTalkng backbone and each has a LEN value. I just want to clarify that I don't need to consider any additional LEN value for the EV-100 despite the fact that it is connected to other components of the autopilot system that are connected to the SeaTalkng backbone.


Thanks again,

Martin

[Chuck - Raymarine - Moderator]

Q1. I just want to confirm that this method of connection IITC-5) does not trigger a LEN value for the analog transducers that I need to consider.
A1. Negative. The LEN value specified within the iTC-5 's installation guide accounts for the load of transducers which will be connected to it.

Q2. I don't need to consider any additional LEN value for the EV-100 despite the fact that it is connected to other components of the autopilot system that are connected to the SeaTalkng backbone.
A2. Correct.

[Martin35]

Chuck,

OK - and with that I'm all out of questions. ;-) Thanks very much for helping a newbie to get a grasp of what is involved in installing a Raymarine Seatalkng system. Very helpful and very much appreciated!
Doing the installation in the next couple of days and I think it should go smoothly.

Regards,

Martin

[Martin35]

Chuck,

Life got in the way and I'm only now getting around to the instrument installation. A couple of additional questions:

1. The attached scan is from pages 28-29 of the "i50 Instrument & Operation Instructions", dated 06-2017, doc number 81341-4.

When connecting the i50 depth/speed and i60 wind instruments to an ITC-5, both the diagram attached at sections 4.5 and 4.6 show no connection to the backbone coming out of the ITC-5 from the middle spur connecting point. The 4.5 diagram shows a power connection at the middle connecting point, and the 4.6 diagram shows nothing, a blank at the spur connection.

Clearly the ITC-5 is already going to be connected to the backbone via both of the other connections. Does it also need to be connected via the middle spur connection?

To clarify, does the middle spur connection also need to be used to connect the ITC-5 to the backbone when the ITC-5 is already supplying data to the backbone via the left and right backbone connections?

2. Does the i70s (master) need to be positioned next in the sequence after the ITC-5, and before the i50 depth/wind and the i60 wind? Or does it not matter where the i70s is placed in the connection sequence? Is there a preferred sequence for connection of related instruments?

3. Same sequence question for the autopilot components (ACU-100, EV unit, p70s), do they need to be connected in sequence or can their individual connections be located anywhere in the backbone?

Thanks in advance.

Regards,

Martin